PTET - godless culture

Dialogue with Darkstar218 - A Summary

Dear Tim

My response to your last post was quite lengthy. I thought it might be helpful to attempt to summarise our respective positions (and please correct me as needed).


1. You argue that the God of the Bible is the basis of what you term "Absolute Morality".

2. You support your beliefs by referring to authorities who support the historical validity of the Bible and in particular its account of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

3. You claim that those "opposing" the historical validity of the Bible appeal what you call "the 'science' of evolution and the Big Bang Theory".

4. You state that God's apparent incitation of immoral acts as narrated in the Bible does not detract from your concept of "Absolute Morality", because God's motives are to "reconcile and restore to fullness".


I say in response:

1. Not all Born Again Christians believe in Absolute Morality; and morality certainly exists in non-Christian cultures. It is for you to establish that both the God of the Bible and "Absolute Morality" exist.

2. Your authorities are dishonest in reporting to you what most historians, archaeologists and Biblical scholars say about the historical validity of the Bible. Most *Christian* authorities recognise that the Bible is not wholly inerrant in all matters. They recognise that the Bible is a human work, although many or most of course believe that it is divinely inspired. It is therefore simply not true to say that science, archaeology and Biblical scholarship on the whole support your arguments regarding the nature of the Bible.

3. Most scientists who are professing Christians support the idea that life has evolved over billions of years through common descent (whether or not God was directly involved in the process). Therefore it is simply not true to say that "evolution" or the concept of the "Big Bang" are somehow opposite to Christianity. Challenges to the prevailing scientific consensus on such matters do not and cannot help the validity of your claims. If you wish to prove that the Bible is scientifically accurate, it is for you to do so using logic and reason. This you have not done.

4. The Bible is clear that the punishments dealt out by God are primarily for disobedience. I say that it is immoral for humans to punish the crimes of wrong-doers by punishing uninvolved bystanders or inciting immoral behaviour in third-parties. God as described in the Bible does these very things (e.g. the Flood, where babes in arms were killed; or 2 Samuel 12:11, where God incites adultery). If it is "moral" for God to do these things; but "immoral" for humans to do the same, then I say that your notion of "Absolute Morality" cannot be used as a basis for human behaviour or morality.

Kind regards





LINKS: Updated Discussion Index | Darkstar218 Weblog | Full text of my last response